I've never done it with weights before and I'm just curious.

Does it make a significant difference to punching power, speed, or both?

I heard it can mess you up doing that, cause injuries real easy

I think its better just to lift weights and hit the heavy bag for power

can anyone else shed some better light on this question?

we asked my boxing trainer about this, he said it doesnt really make a difference, and its not worth the trouble.

No. It won't make you faster but will only increase your muscular endurance. Even so, it is not recommended as it will cause your muscle memory to "remember' punching slowly and as a result, you will punch slowly than your usual speed BUT ONLY IF YOU USE HEAVY WEIGHTS. The best way is to use light weights and punching it pyramid-style e.g. punching with 5 pounds 100 times progressing to 0 pounds with 100 reps each and then going up again from 0 to 5 pounds with 100 reps again. This will increase your muscular endurance and arm strength and also improve muscle tone on your back and shoulders

Thanks for the advice guys.

I was never planning on using heavy weights for this anyways, as I'm pretty they'd do more harm than good.

I've seen Fedor use some light weights while shadowboxing before and Buakaw uses them in this video...

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He's using 3 lbs and 11 lbs in the vid. I'll try it out once and see how it goes.

Its for endurance, mainly.

You can make a fair puncher into a great puncher, however not a KO artist.
Ko artists are born.

Doing weightlifting won't do much to increase power, doing boxing will.
You have to do excerises to increase speed, accuracy, technique.

To acheive speed and power.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=193C2US7

Weightlifting comes into play when you want to get bigger and stronger with proper nutrition of course.
Bigger and Stronger.
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=1838CH1A

No. It won't make you faster but will only increase your muscular endurance. Even so, it is not recommended as it will cause your muscle memory to "remember' punching slowly and as a result, you will punch slowly than your usual speed BUT ONLY IF YOU USE HEAVY WEIGHTS. The best way is to use light weights and punching it pyramid-style e.g. punching with 5 pounds 100 times progressing to 0 pounds with 100 reps each and then going up again from 0 to 5 pounds with 100 reps again. This will increase your muscular endurance and arm strength and also improve muscle tone on your back and shoulders

you will never have muscle tone, if you eat a shitload.

You can’t tone muscles by doing higher reps. If you want tone, strength is your tool. Strength builds muscle. Losing fat will take care of the tone & show the muscles. Only thing higher rep range does is building endurance.

www.stronglifts.com

No. It won't make you faster but will only increase your muscular endurance. Even so, it is not recommended as it will cause your muscle memory to "remember' punching slowly and as a result, you will punch slowly than your usual speed BUT ONLY IF YOU USE HEAVY WEIGHTS.

I think thats why they have contraptions like this in lieu of weights

http://us.st11.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.com/I/yhst-61256533887862_1971_789416

Be very careful. I did this many years ago and messed up my arms for a while. I figured if I could punch fast with weights in my hands the naturally I would be faster without them. It wasn't worth it.

Be very careful. I did this many years ago and messed up my arms for a while. I figured if I could punch fast with weights in my hands the naturally I would be faster without them. It wasn't worth it.

what happened?
tell us your story

Be very careful. I did this many years ago and messed up my arms for a while. I figured if I could punch fast with weights in my hands the naturally I would be faster without them. It wasn't worth it.

Hmm, how many pounds did you use?

Damn, I've been doing this for a year. Saw it in a movie or some show

I think you're best off just shadow boxing in front of the mirror to improve your technique and adjust any flaws you may have.

It would definately increase your muscular endurance. You'd be able to keep your hands up and punch for a much longer amount of time. But punching power doens't have a whole lot to do with arm strength.

what happened?
tell us your story

Hmm, how many pounds did you use?

I'm quite a few years older than most of you. When I was 19 and training Tae Kwon Do/Kickboxing, I was so addicted to the sport and wanted to do anything possible to excel at it. One night I got the bright idea the take 5lb weights and not only shadow box with then but pretty much punch with them about as hard and as fast as I could because I figured if I'm already a fast puncher that this would make me super fast. Well, the next day when I went to class my instructor asked me why I was so sore and not giving 100% as usual. I told him I was shadow boxing with weights the night before. He then said "You weren't punching hard with them were you? Because you can really screw up your arms and pull muscles" I told him that I did and he just shook his head at me and told me never to do it again.

This was just my experience as someone who did it on my own without consulting anyone first. I'm sure that there is a proper way to go about it with lighter weights that would work fine. My advice is to do some research before doing such a thing.

I've heard a lot of mixed reviews on punching with weights...

Some say doing it will help immensely, others say it's a waste of time...

either way, when doing it you need to be very careful like Squirrel said... I had a friend do this all the time and he ended up popping his elbow or some shit... you can't go anywhere near 100% when shadowboxing with weights and from what I've read/experienced it's not good to throw pucnhes all out when shadowboxing at all as you risk hyperextension...

Its for endurance, mainly.

You can make a fair puncher into a great puncher, however not a KO artist.
Ko artists are born.

Doing weightlifting won't do much to increase power, doing boxing will.
You have to do excerises to increase speed, accuracy, technique.

To acheive speed and power.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=193C2US7

Weightlifting comes into play when you want to get bigger and stronger with proper nutrition of course.
Bigger and Stronger.
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=1838CH1A

Come on now. That's not true anyone can become a knockout puncher. Dempsey said it himself.

A KO artist is merely someone who knows when to throw.

And lifting weights can increase explosive strength which is half of where punching power comes from(excluding technique of course I'm assuming the person already has good technique) the other half is mass which is also aided by lifting weights. Mass x Acceleration = Force

Come on now. That's not true anyone can become a knockout puncher. Dempsey said it himself.

A KO artist is merely someone who knows when to throw.

And lifting weights can increase explosive strength which is half of where punching power comes from(excluding technique of course I'm assuming the person already has good technique) the other half is mass which is also aided by lifting weights. Mass x Acceleration = Force

what type of weight lifting are we talking about?
For looks, or for sport? there is a difference.
Mass is added by eating, and lifting weights.

Teddy atlas said it.
Punchers are born, not made.
if it wasn't true, every boxer would have insane KO power, but they don't.
Some Boxers just have raw power that can't be trained, Foreman, Shavers, Liston, Louis, Tyson, etc.

A boxing analyst has said it about Joe Louis countless times.

"You can make a fair puncher into a great puncher, however not a KO artist."

I actually worded exactly what he said about Joe Louis.

Dempsey, and Cus were the ones that said that about KO power..
Cus said, "There is no such thing as a natural puncher, you could have the natural aptitude for punching, but that's it."
Something like that, I don't know If I believe it though.

Teddy Atlas said the complete opposite.
I agree with Teddy though.

"KO artist is merely someone who knows when to throw."
I agree with that though, but I'm talking about Power, not anything else right now.

what type of weight lifting are we talking about?
For looks, or for sport? there is a difference.
Mass is added by eating, and lifting weights.

Teddy atlas said it.
Punchers are born, not made.
if it wasn't true, every boxer would have insane KO power, but they don't.
Some Boxers just have raw power that can't be trained, Foreman, Shavers, Liston, Louis, Tyson, etc.

A boxing analyst has said it about Joe Louis countless times.

"You can make a fair puncher into a great puncher, however not a KO artist."

I actually worded exactly what he said about Joe Louis.

Dempsey, and Cus were the ones that said that about KO power..
Cus said, "There is no such thing as a natural puncher, you could have the natural aptitude for punching, but that's it."
Something like that, I don't know If I believe it though.

Teddy Atlas said the complete opposite.
I agree with Teddy though.

"KO artist is merely someone who knows when to throw."
I agree with that though, but I'm talking about Power, not anything else right now.

I was referring to lifting to increase attributes.

Every single muscle can increase in size and power on everyones body. Because of this in theory over a long enough time period we could all become KO artists. I think it just comes more naturally to some just like some people can naturally jump high like Vince Carter who is rumored to have a 43 inch vertical. Then you take Kelly Baggett who had a 21 inch vertical in highschool, but through training brought it up to a 42. He could've taken it farther, but he chose not to.

Now heres how I see it, throwing a punch is just like jumping in that it's an activity that relies on power. So by increasing our maximal and explosive strength we can create more power. When we get as explosive as we can at our current strength level we simply increase our maximal strength then start increasing our explosive strength again.

So here comes another basketball analogy now if a guy can't jump good, but wants to be a great ball player he shouldn't dedicate all his time to jumping because then he will be a good jumper, but won't be any better at basketball. So it's a better use of time to work on things like dribbling, passing, and shooting. Much like rather than spending all your time trying to make yourself a KO machine you should be working on your footwork, conditioning, focus mitts and most importantly sparring.

So in conclusion anyone can become a KO artist(power wise) if they dedicated all of their time into increasing punching power. But then they wouldn't be a very good boxer. And that is my reasoning on why everyone doesn't punch like Louis, Tyson, etc.

Shit bro, thats to long to read.
lol.
I read the last paragraph, and I disagree on people having power of a foreman, shavers. etc

There are some things that you can't train for.
Like the god given speed of ali, and RJJ.

and the raw power of foreman, shavers, and Tyson.

Ko power is either you have it or you don't.
you can make it better, and you can train it to get better.
but not everyone is gonan be a KO artists.
Genetics play a huge role in power, speed, etc.

"Knockout power can't be taught".

endurance

Shit bro, thats to long to read.
lol.
I read the last paragraph, and I disagree on people having power of a foreman, shavers. etc

There are some things that you can't train for.
Like the god given speed of ali, and RJJ.

and the raw power of foreman, shavers, and Tyson.

Ko power is either you have it or you don't.
you can make it better, and you can train it to get better.
but not everyone is gonan be a KO artists.
Genetics play a huge role in power, speed, etc.


Here is an article by Kelly Baggett showing how the internal and external systems work. By that I mean muscular and nervous.


http://www.higher-faster-sports.com/quicknessvsspeed.html

Since there seems to be nothing about the human muscular and nervous sytems that can't be enhanced. Then over a long enough time period everyone could acheive Foreman like power or Ali like speed. Theres no reason why they wouldn't be able to acheive this, assuming that they are healthy of course.

Here is an article by Kelly Baggett showing how the internal and external systems work. By that I mean muscular and nervous.


http://www.higher-faster-sports.com/quicknessvsspeed.html

Since there seems to be nothing about the human muscular and nervous sytems that can't be enhanced. Then over a long enough time period everyone could acheive Foreman like power or Ali like speed. Theres no reason why they wouldn't be able to acheive this, assuming that they are healthy of course.

I just don't agree with that.

That's like saying everyone can have a godlike body chiseled to stone.
Some people can, and some can't.

but hey, believe it what you want.

If everyone can achieve god like power, or speed.. then wouldn't boxers have all one punch power? or be fast as hell?

The boxing world would be the same if it wasn't the case of genetics.

I respect your opinion though.

I just don't agree with that.

That's like saying everyone can have a godlike body chiseled to stone.
Some people can, and some can't.

They can if they watch their nutrition and workout correctly.

but hey, believe it what you want.

If everyone can achieve god like power, or speed.. then wouldn't boxers have all one punch power? or be fast as hell?

The boxing world would be the same if it wasn't the case of genetics.

Well like I wrote in my long post, while everyone could acheive the power by the time some acheived it they wouldn't have time to become a good boxer. Therefor they should spend more time on boxing and less time on increasing power.Note I didn't say no time on punching power just not all their time.

An example would be who would you take in a boxing match Tank Abbott or James Toney? Let's say Tank represents the guy who spent all his time trying to get that one punch KO power and that Toney instead divided his time into becoming a better boxer. Tank has little to no skill in boxing, but he does have that big punch. Toney on the other hand has a fair punch, but is much more skilled than Tank.

Until some research comes up showing that something used in punching can't be improved then my logic will remain, that if all parts of something can be improved it as whole can be improved.

I respect your opinion though.

Thanks, I respect yours aswell. I used to have a similar belief, but my readings on the application of strength training have since changed my views.

I'm not talking about skills of boxing.

I'm talking about KO POWER RAW POWER.
Foreman, Shavers, Tyson...all of them.

just like frank shamrock said, "Bodybuilders get that body with steroids, and exceptional genetics."

Genetics are very important man.
Silly to think otherwise.

and he also said, that some people just might not be toned, some people can get that body and some cant.

I can't believe you think otherwise though.

Mike Tyson didn't do any weightlifting ever in his prime, and look at his body,
at 13 he was 200 pounds of muscle. That right there tells that genetically tyson was gonna be muscular.
and then look at someone like frazier, dieted well, excerised yet he wasn't chiseled to the least as in tyson.

I'm not talking about skills of boxing.

I'm talking about KO POWER RAW POWER.
Foreman, Shavers, Tyson...all of them.

What I'm saying is that it would take some people so much time to get themselves this KO power, that they wouldn't have time to become a good boxer. Thus making it rather pointless and time would be better spent becoming a better boxer.

just like frank shamrock said, "Bodybuilders get that body with steroids, and exceptional genetics."

Genetics are very important man.
Silly to think otherwise.

and he also said, that some people just might not be toned, some people can get that body and some cant.

I can't believe you think otherwise though.

Mike Tyson didn't do any weightlifting ever in his prime, and look at his body,
at 13 he was 200 pounds of muscle. That right there tells that genetically tyson was gonna be muscular.
and then look at someone like frazier, dieted well, excerised yet he wasn't chiseled to the least as in tyson.

I've never seen someone who's taken steroids and tried to get big stay small.

I completely agree that genetics help out alot. It's basically what I've been saying. People with poor genetics can reach a bulky ripped body, but it will take them much much longer than someone with good genetics. Now looking the same is something we can't all do. As some people have longer/shorter muscles than others. But we can all acheive a gain in size and a lower bodyfat percentage.

If you take two guys one with super genetics and another with poor genetics and have them both start training for bodybuilding at the same time the superior genetics will take off like a bullet and will see great results very quickly. The one with poor genetics won't see results as quickly and it may take him double the time to reach what the superior genetic guy has accomplished.

<a href="http://s94.photobucket.com/albums/l116/blevunly/?action=view&current=joe_frazier.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l116/blevunly/joe_frazier.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

Frazier had some decent size on him and low bodyfat. If he would've quit boxing and focused on his physique instead he could've had a good one. All he needed to do was add some muscle on his chest and lose some bodyfat. Tyson didn't train to be chiseled, neither did Joe. Therefor we can see Tyson had the better genetics. That doesn't change the fact that Joe could've had a better looking body had he trained for it.

Look at Christian Thibaudeau he was a self proclaime skinny fat kid who sucked at sports and now. He Cleans and Jerks 357lbs, Snatches 291lbs, Full Squats 561lbs, and Bench Presses 395lbs. He also Transformed his physique.

<a href="http://s94.photobucket.com/albums/l116/blevunly/?action=view&current=CT.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l116/blevunly/CT.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

I guess we agree to an extent.

Yeah, we seem to agree that some people are born with KO power. We also agree it is possible to improve power. We just differ on the extent it can be improved.

A few key points I want to emphasize are:

1. If someone spent all their time devloping their KO power they wouldn't have anytime to develop their boxing skills. Thus wouldn't be a good boxer, making the KO power somewhat pointless to have.

and...

2. There is nothing involved in KO power that cannot be improved and we have yet to find a place where our physical abilities top off. Therefor it appears the only factor limiting our full potential is time.

Yep.

its good and use very light weights like 3 kgs and punch out straight dont throw uppercuts and hooks

I only ever do it with 5lb weights towards the end of a workout when im already tired and focus on still throwing with good technique and keeping my hands up not for punching power or speed. If youre looking for that using resistance bands or something of the like will work better

"Not everyone can become a knockout artist, only a few have such potential"
- Someone from my Gym

gloves are weights you where on your hands.


well i dont know if you guys notice a difference between a 10oz glove and an 18 oz+ gloves but its a huge difference to me. using w8s wrong... doing anything wrong is gonna be bad. if you dont know how to do it then use the approach of wearing heavier gloves. in the end it would more natural feeling going from a heavy ass glove to a 14-12oz glove.

weights are unneccessary. big gloves, heavy bag, good technique, and proper stretching is all thats really needed to promote power. it takes hours upon hours upon years to get what you want. just gotta want it enuff.

also having your hands wrapped up firm makes a huge difference in power imo.

gloves are weights you where on your hands.


well i dont know if you guys notice a difference between a 10oz glove and an 18 oz+ gloves but its a huge difference to me. using w8s wrong... doing anything wrong is gonna be bad. if you dont know how to do it then use the approach of wearing heavier gloves. in the end it would more natural feeling going from a heavy ass glove to a 14-12oz glove.

weights are unneccessary. big gloves, heavy bag, good technique, and proper stretching is all thats really needed to promote power. it takes hours upon hours upon years to get what you want. just gotta want it enuff.

As far as training goes...

training for skill > increasing force with weights

training for skill and using weights to increase force > training for skill

No need to limit yourself.

Good point about heavier gloves though.

i was assuming ppl had enough to focus on power.

i was assuming ppl had enough to focus on power.

had enough what?

skill, thats what he meant.

Oh, well if you have enough skill then you should spend just about all your time lifting weights to increase the amount of force you have to work with.

lifting weights won't get you bigger.
Eating will. Only reason why they weight lift is so they can turn the weight they gained into muscle.

lifting weights won't get you bigger.
Eating will. Only reason why they weight lift is so they can turn the weight they gained into muscle.

I know man. You should lift weight's to increase your ability to accelerate your weight

FORCE = MASS x ACCELERATION

Weights allow you to increase your acceleration with little increase in your mass allow you to stay in your weightclass.

Only a fool would shadow box with weights (unless we're talking about very small weights, and if so whats the point?) Just hit the heavy bag for power, thats the sure fire, tried tested and true method.

who cares people. Why does everyone want power? that is the least important thing in boxing. Its a great addition, but you don't need it. oh well, I digress. I say something, some will listen, and some won't.
So if you want to know, ask me.

FIrst you get the power, then you get the money, then you get the women.

Seriously though why wouldn't someone want power? Boxing skills are great but if you can punch you'll always make money

If you have the skills, you'll make more money, and get more women.

if you have the skills, you'll always make money too.

In my opinion the risk of injury out weighs any gains you would make by punching with weights.

If you want to add resistance to your shadowboxing I would recommend some form of bands or tubing. This would definitely increase your muscular endurance but in a safer way.

I use the ones from here but they are available all over the net http://www.lifelineusa.com/

I would also recommend that you check out this site and the videos and form. Ross has some great info and I would highly recommend his products and advice.
http://www.rossboxing.com/

I have tried various tools to give resistance to punching, wrist weights, hand weights etc. Difficult to beat a good ole fashioned heavy bag for power and focus pads for sharpness, depending on how good your training partner or coach is. I believe weights are not actually effective as you throw the weight and the resistance is actually acting with gravity, if you're standing up. What you really need is resistance in opposition to the direction of your punch. I remember a piece of equipment that Evander Holyfield used years ago which looked cool and have searched everywhere for it the closest I have found are the Iron Woody bands (http://www.ironwoodyfitness.com/fitness-bands.php) which are good for hooks although you need a spare pole to attached them to! Also the shadow boxer VRT (http://www.shadow-boxer.co.uk) are also pretty good for jabs and crosses, not for hooks, but has the advantage of being independent of being attached to a wall, pole, floor etc. Finally I agree with the previous post Ross Boxing has some great training tips. Power isn't everything as per the quote from the film 'once were warriors' ..." You were right too much weights and not enough speed work, useless pri$%k!"

I'm quite a few years older than most of you. When I was 19 and training Tae Kwon Do/Kickboxing, I was so addicted to the sport and wanted to do anything possible to excel at it. One night I got the bright idea the take 5lb weights and not only shadow box with then but pretty much punch with them about as hard and as fast as I could because I figured if I'm already a fast puncher that this would make me super fast. Well, the next day when I went to class my instructor asked me why I was so sore and not giving 100% as usual. I told him I was shadow boxing with weights the night before. He then said "You weren't punching hard with them were you? Because you can really screw up your arms and pull muscles" I told him that I did and he just shook his head at me and told me never to do it again.

This was just my experience as someone who did it on my own without consulting anyone first. I'm sure that there is a proper way to go about it with lighter weights that would work fine. My advice is to do some research before doing such a thing.


I like this story. :popcorn: